meganbmoore | Dollhouse 1.2

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tv: dollhouse

Dollhouse 1.2

For those wanting to know if it gets less skeevtastic: We'll let you know. Don't worry. You'll notice by how we don't rush to take a scalding shower after to try to get the NOBADWRONG AND NOT IN THE FUN WAY off.

Honestly, the show is obviously aware of how skeevy and wrong the entire concept is, and that's a good thing. But I can't help but think that it thinks that knowing that it has those problems makes the problems ok.

Beyond that, the central problem I'm having right now (aside from sexing it up way too much) is Echo. Or rather, the deliberate lack of substance to latch on to there. Who am I supposed to be latching on to, here? Boyd and Dr. Fred are fairly likable and sympathetic, but they also work for the company, apparently of their own free will, meaning they endorse things like apparently regularly literally whoring Echo (and persumably others) out for the weekend. Director Lady is interesting, but running the Dollhouse. Her flunky is...a flunky. Topher is repulsive and giddy that he gets to mess around with people's heads. This episode also makes me think that he's unaware of-or doesn't care about-the consequences of that, which makes him far, far worse. Agent Helo has potential, but is removed from the main action. Also, the actor is pretty and likable, but doesn't seem to be much of an actor. And I think I liked the character-as shown so far-better a few months ago when I watched the first season of Sarah Connor Chronicles and his name was Ellison.

Which brings us back to Echo. Obviously, I'm supposed to be rooting for her, but who am I rooting for. Am I rooting for Caroline, the girl who wanted the world but had something go horribly wrong? The persinality of the week, who will only be onscreen for maybe 25 minutes of the episode? Or is it Echo, the childlike, almost literally brainless near robot? See, I can like Echo. I can feel sympathy for her. I can pity her. In a similar way to how I'd automatically do the same for a lost three-year-old I saw at the mall, or a dog that wandered up to me and asked me to pet it. But there's nothing to grab on to with her, and the fact that the show makes her an empty, childlike shell deliberately only adds to my frustration.

An excerpt from IMs about 12 minutes in:

meganbmoore : OH GOD HE HUNTS WOMEN DOESN'T HE DON'T ANSWER THEY REALLY ARE GOING THERE AREN'T THEY?

prozacpark : DUDE, you called it!

prozacpark : You're good.

prozacpark : Heh.

prozacpark : I didn't.

meganbmoore : SSSHHH!

meganbmoore : Don't spoil me!

There was then a brief discussion where I dumped her after realizing she was cheating on me and watching the show without me when we're supposedly watching it together to dull her pain, but she begged me to take her back.

Later, there was this:

meganbmoore : I AM DISTURBED THAT I KNEW HE HUNTED PEOPLE WHEN HE TALKED ABOUT HUNTING LUNCH

prozacpark : Heh. Yeah, me too. Mostly, I was all, "Oh, gods, what kind of stuff has she been reading/watching to know this pattern?"

meganbmoore : So, when he was talking about how others don't meet his needs, he meant they died too soon, huh?

prozacpark : I'm, um, not helping with your being disturbed thing, am I?

meganbmoore : IT WAS THE WORST THING I COULD THINK OF FOR THE SETUP

prozacpark : Sure.

So yeah, this week, Echo was sold to be a hunter's sex bunny for the weekend, except he secretly liked to hunt women to make them prove they deserved to exist. At least Echo shot him, beat him up, and shoved an arrow in his throat?

Also, there were artistically posed bodies of naked men in the shower. It may have changed the ratio of artistically posed bodies of naked wommen/artistically posed bodies of naked men on US television to about 50000000/1. Honestly, I do give the show some credit for that, though I think most of it was negated by the erotically posed naked Echo in the middle of it.

Anyway, the episode is divided into flashbacks covering the 3 months before the series, and the guy Echo was pimped out to this week. (3 of the 4 customers she's been sold to so far where we've seen part of it wanted her for a weekend girlfriend. And one wanted to kill her on top of that.) Both were focused on Echo and her relationship with her handler, Boyd.

In the flashbacks, we learn that an agent named Alpha went nuts and killed a bunch of people three months ago, including Echo's handler, but left Echo naked and untouched in the bathtub, surrounded by dead bodies. We also learn that that's how Dr. Fred got her scars. Boyd is brought in and seems suitably disgusted by the setup, but becomes Echo's handler anyway. Their having a surprisingly sweet and likable relationship in the current timeline takes an odd turn when we learn that the dolls are imprinted with trust and devotion towards their handlers. The process includes dialogue disturbingly like marriage vows. In which the bride is a 3-year-old in an adult's body. In all honesty, the scenes where he picks her up after her assignments make me think of those stories where the high class whore's/rich man's mistress's chauffuer is in love with her. Except that I'm pretty sure Boyd's love for Echo is platonic. PLEASE LET IT BE PLATONIC!

Boyd also wins a few points for placing the blame for Alpha's rampage on Topher. Topher says that program still has some kinks to be worked out, like blood, screaming and dying.

Uhm...I don't know that I've ever hated a character as quickly as I do him. I mean, we're obviously supposed to find him creepy and sociopathic, but I'm pretty sure we're not supposed to be mentally chanting "DIE DIE DIE!!" every time he's on screen.

Dr. Fred also tells Boyd that the company hunted down Alpha and shot him in the head after he escaped. I HAVE THEORIES ABOUT THIS!

In the current story, Echo is sold to be a outdoorsman's weekend girlfriend, but the company doesn't know that the guy also hunts his dates and makes them prove that they have a right to live by escaping. Apparently, most disappoint him by dying quickly. Boyd figures out something's up and goes off to save her. The hunt itself was a bit boring and predictable, but made worthwhile by Echo having flashes of-and even getting a pep talk from-Caroline, and possibly other personalities she's been imprinted with. There are also scenes where her implanted personality meets and trusts Boyd even though she doesn't recognize him that would be sweet were it not for the marriage vows-like imprinting. I admit to "aww"-ing when they cuddled after she killed the hunter, though.

Agent Helo is still wandering around, looking for info about the Dollhouse, and someone sends him a picture of Caroline. The Dollhouse knows about him but is leaving him alone for now. He has a pretty and curious neighbor. I am convinced that she is an active and will not be persuaded otherwise unless I have no choice.

THEORIES TIME!!!

The episode strongly hints that the personas the dolls are imprinted with are not completely erased when they're deactivated, as is supposed to happen. In addition, Caroline, or at least a part of her, is still lurking about somewhere inside of Echo. I also have a strong suspicion that, if an Actives life is seriously threatened, it at least partially switches over to another personality. Echo seemed to change abruptly when she decided to take the fight to the hunter after meeting Boyd (Maybe it was the gun that did it?) and seemed much more focused and driven. It could, of course, just be the adrenaline talking, but it reminded me that Topher was worried she'd commit suicide in the first episode because the woman whose personality she was imprinted with had done so. If Penn had been about to give up, another personality could have emerged enough to make sure she succeeded. We also have Caroline and what appear to be other past personas giving the current persona a peptalk when she's about to die.

I suspect Echo will be slowly developing a personality throughout the season, made up of bits of Caroline, and bits of various imprints. Which seems to include a surprising number of sexbunnies.

Which brings me to Alpha. I think he's Agent Helo. Ok, maybe not, but Alpha's silhouette vaguely matches up, and it'd be nifty if there was something going on where the dominant persona was manipulating several others without their knowing it. It would also explain why Director Ladywas so laid back about Agent Helo looking for them. Anyway, I'm thinking a nasty persona woke up for some reason, and it-alone or in conjunction with others-is still around. Obvious, but stick with me.

The name "Alpha" implies that he was the first. Going back to my theory that a threat can bring up past imprints, I wonder if perhaps Alpha was going to be "retired" somehow. This could be (1) that the dolls are killed when their usefulness is over, (2) that he was supposed to get his original personality back, but something went wrong, (3) the above, but the dormant personalities reacted to the threat of being permanently extinguished.

Obviously, far too early to really stand behind any theories.

Threaded | Flat

I am liking the theory I've been reading around that Dr. Fred is actually a Doll. I think that would be really interesting, as would the theories you've brought up here, but like you said - too early.

I'm having the same problems with Echo that you are - I love Buffy as a show in large part because I love Buffy herself, as a viewer I connect with her and want to see the world through her eyes. I feel Joss is taking a route to slowly build Echo into a Buffyesque sort of heroine, but there's no connection to start with, no reason for me to care what happens to Echo or any of the Actives. Boyd is pretty fantastic, and I am fond of him, but that's not really enough for me?

Hopefully my faith in Joss having some grand plan is not misplaced!

Topher is repulsive and giddy that he gets to mess around with people's heads. This episode also makes me think that he's unaware of-or doesn't care about-the consequences of that, which makes him far, far worse. Agent Helo has potential, but is removed from the main action. Also, the actor is pretty and likable, but doesn't seem to be much of an actor.

Is Topher mr. "I take all their porn and wack off to it" boy? Because, ick.

And, oh, Tahmoh, yes. PRETTY. But, uh. No. Not that great an actor (he does a little better on BSG, where, to be fair, he has a much higher caliber of actor to bounce off of--hence, it's possible they rub off on him there).

I don't actually read what is going on with Boyd and Echo as anything that will ever approach a romantic relationship, they don't have that vibe, I feel like Whedon is trying to build a Giles-Buffy kind of relationship there where it will grow more paternal as time goes on. If it ever tends towards romantic, I am dropping the show no ifs ands or buts, you know if I don't drop it for other reasons first.

The sexualized propping of cut up bodies also deeply bothered me, it was like 'no, just no'.

And the stuff with the male actives are nice, but still discounted by naked vulnerable Echo and us not seeing them come off assignments where they are little more then sexual objects for skeevy men.

Uhm...I don't know that I've ever hated a character as quickly as I do him. I mean, we're obviously supposed to find him creepy and sociopathic, but I'm pretty sure we're not supposed to be mentally chanting "DIE DIE DIE!!" every time he's on screen.

I don't know if you are supposed to chant diediedie, but I will join you. UGH.

Agent Helo

I lol'd. :D

But I think I'll being staying far away from this show. Even if they did handle all the creepybadwrong in a graceful manner (which from what you've said, they aren't quite managing it), I think I'd still be too massively creeped out.

There was then a brief discussion where I dumped her after realizing she was cheating on me and watching the show without me when we're supposedly watching it together to dull her pain, but she begged me to take her back.

LIES! You knew about the cheating, and it was totally meant to be an open relationship. ;)

All I got out of the episode: SHOULDER TO THE WHEEL! I have no idea what that even means.

Obviously, far too early to really stand behind any theories.

This is so getting canned before you find out either way. It's entirely possible they haven't even planned that far ahead in anticipation of the sudden but inevitable cancellation?

I need to think about this show's skeevy factor in context of what made the last two seasons of Buffy sort of skeevy for me.

I have the feeling, based mostly on 'shock value', that Topher will get a redemptive arc and Boyd will turn out to be a villain, possibly with a perverse sexual lust for Echo. There'll be a scene between him and Ballard about the Dollhouse, Ballard will leave, and Echo will walk out in some scanty lingerie to completely gross the audience out.

After all, there are two big mysteries about Boyd remaining: Why he's no longer a cop and why he joined the Dollhouse. Him being a corrupt cop and/or having a morally abhorrent fetish would tie things up nicely for an Echo vs. Dollhouse arc.

Of course, in a year, Echo could be running the Dollhouse and I'll be wondering what the hell I'd been smoking...

I actually find Handler Man the skeeviest of them all. He knows better and yet there he goes, accompanying Echo as she's whored out to various people despite knowing it's wrong, wrong, wrong. Mr. Mind Wiper at least is not disguising his involvement.

I wish I thought this show was clever enough to have Helo be Alpha. I just don't think it is.

ETA: I feel firmly that Fox will not be at fault if this fails. If it fails it will fail because it is deeply, profoundly dumb and not in fun ways.

Thank you for viewing this so I don't have to ^^.

So is Joss Whedon stealing wholeheartedly from the Gunslinger Girl anime, but for the fact that Echo is a grown woman and not set up as the perfect assassin right away?

Who am I supposed to be latching on to, here?

I'm going with Alpha here. Because he wants all the other characters dead, and so do I.

I also have a strong suspicion that, if an Actives life is seriously threatened, it at least partially switches over to another personality.

I was wondering about this, too. The whole end of the hunt, with the duel and such, just didn't make any sense in the context of the existing personality, and the only explanation ~~other than shoddy writing~~ that seemed to make any sense was some sort of failsafe.

Discussion of which I would love to see! Only two episodes in, I know, but I'm already getting a little frustrated about the disconnect between what the show wants to tell me about the imprints and what I really want to know. Because there _is_ stuff that I want to know. They just aren't going there.

I felt it was actually rather unclear as to whether the hunter was a genuine serial killer, considering he had been hired, and had created a fake identity under Richard Connell. . .no, I can't say that without smirking. I love that they named him that.

I'm not so sure about how immoral Topher is. I liked him in episode one, and I still do when Whedon isn't trying to turn him into Xander for no reason. "Hello, Man-friend!" He's doesn't seem to like the power so much as rationalize it away to me, and while that can be just as bad, it's more interesting. I may not like him as a person, but he intrigues me as a character.

Oh, Whedon's trying to have a deep, thought-provoking discussion about sex and prostitution here, but being blocked by Fox from going any further than disturbing implications. He has explicitly stated this, actually.

Echo is totally a character, to me. She's a force to be reckoned with, and every minute, she's just a little closer to bursting out of her shell. After all, so far, both episodes have had the theme of victims overcoming the force that's victimizing them. Also, yes, I'm certain Boyd's love for Echo will never go beyond paternal. It being anything else strikes me as really unlikely.

Personally, my favorite part of this was where she defies the trust imprint, "No, it's NOT going to be all right!"

I...am so planning on waiting until the end of the season, and then going in fully armed with spoilers before watching.

Maybe it's just me but I don't get why Hunter would drug Echo. I mean... isn't the point to have the person you're hunting have all their wits about them so it's even more fun to hunt them? Drugging them just slows them down and makes them... sloppier.

I totally knew the hunting thing was going to happen when he said that the other girls didn't live up to his standards/disappointed him. I was like aaaah-haaaa. :|

I also think the neighbor is an active,because director lady said "Don't worry about him he's being taken care of" or something of the sort and it cuts to him and the neighbor interacting.

Also I think the personalities aren't being completely wiped, seeing as how Echo did the shoulder to the wheel slap at the end of the episode.

I'd love to see more non-sex bunny assignments so that hint of skeeviness could leave please. Surely there are other reasons to hire people like this? I mean they showed us one such scenario in the first episode so....

Also liked how we saw that there were more male dolls this time around. Would like some more Sierra please, she's pretty!

I doubt it will ever be less skeevtastic. Because that's the WHOLE PREMISE, as far as I can tell.

I'm assuming Alpha was the first Doll, Echo the fifth and B,C and D are all the dead ones in the flashback. That said, maybe after a period of time, you get this composite effect where all the personalities merge, and that's starting to happen to Echo. Probably pushed along by Alpha now.

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