anime: Samurai Champloo

[meganbmoore]

If the whole series had been more like eps 20+, this likely would have ended up hovering around my favorites list, but as it is, I had the same problems with it that I did with Cowboy Bebop...too much about the music, style and action scenes and not enough about the story or characterization.  I mean, I'm(obviously, if you read my anime posts) always good for a good action anime, but it's hard to care about the action if it's about the action instead of the who or why.  I was more attached to this one than Cowboy Bebop(which, incidentally, is far from being the worst case of "style over substance" and I did like...like Samurai Champloo...it's just that the popularity of both rests much more on how the story is told than the story that's being told or the people in the story, and that's not my thing)

But the last leg was really good(and 20-21 had Sara, the only female in the show besides Fuu who was remotely interesting) and I'd probably have a different opinion of it if the whole thing was more like the last episodes, because that's when the focus shifts to story and character...Cowboy Bebop did the same thing towards the tail end, and that was when I really started paying attention to it, too.)

Comments

[bzoppa.livejournal.com]

Cowboy Bebop was one of the first anime series I saw. I think it appealed to Americans so much because it was more accessible (not to mention the English dub was pretty good). Americans aren't used to big involved plots with massive characterization and threads of things introduced in ep 1 and resolved in ep 26. Cowboy Bebop only had that one arc or so that was barely addressed in only a few eps. More standalones.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Oh yes, I easily understand why Cowboy Bebop is so highly regarded because it(and Trigun) tends to be one of the first few animes most fans are exposed to. If it had been one of my earlier animes(instead of my only finally watching it a few months ago) I'd likely be nuts about it, as opposed to being able to respect it, but mostly be neutral about it. My earliest animes were Samurai Deeper Kyo, Spiral, Ghost in the Shell(though I didn't get to watch the second half until recently) Twelve Kingdoms, Wolf's Rain and then(actually, before) Miyazaki's Princess Mononoke and Spirited Away, with Escaflowne. Ninja Scrool, Fruits Basket, InuYasha(which I desperately need to catch up on) and Witchhunter Robin closely followed. I'm fine with standalones(Kino's Journey, one of my favorites, has virtually NO overall plot, just standalones)...what I mean is that Cowboy Bebop and Samurai Champloo both get so caught up in their style and cool(which I happily concede both have their fair share of) that they start forgetting things like the episode's plot and the characters.

[bzoppa.livejournal.com]

You haven't listed RahXephon. If you haven't seen that, I would HIGHLY HIGHLY RECOMMEND IT. It was the first series I saw, a couple of years ago. I was... blown away. It was everything I'd been hunting for in stories and was sadly disappointed by American attempts.

The guy who got me into it said if I wasn't hooked by the 4th ep I could put it aside. I was floored within the first 10.

However, you've watched a lot so it could definitely already be on your list of have-seens.

Same people who made Wolf's Rain (which I never finished, but liked the beginning; I heard it didn't have a greate ending).

[bzoppa.livejournal.com]

er, floored within the first 10 MINUTES. Sheesh.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

What's RahXephon about?

Wolf's Rain has a very good ending...almost every time an anime I love gets trashed for the ending, it's because not everyone lived and they want their characters to all live and skip off happily in the sunset, even if the actual ending is the RIGHT ending(which it is for Wolf's Rain...any other ending...except maybe the last 2 minutes, which you can defend or ignore depending on your preferences...would have been wrongwrongwrong for the series)

[bzoppa.livejournal.com]

Wolf's Rain has a very good ending

Really! I might have to give it a better shot, then. I think I watched about the first 12, then caught people complaining around ep 18. This was back when it came out which would've been, what, 2003? 2004?

RahXephon is, in the brilliant words of plateoshrimp "Evangelion for people who like good things." There is a lot of similarity in terms of mecha and the Boy Who Could Pilot, but the characters are much more sympathetic. As crappy as the animation was in Eva and the story was off-the-wall (which I loved about it), you have to give the director props for making his protagonists some of the most unlikeable characters ever. Takes some balls.

Like I said, RahXephon got me into anime. Fullmetal Alchemist is definitely better, but the person who recommended FMA also gave me RahXephon as a place to start. You've got your military, your apocalypse, the "Men behind the scenes," and multiple villains. There's also the OTP and the distractors on both sides.

I'm going to have to re-watch it very very soon. I've seen it through two or three times and there are still pieces I'm fitting in. I'll go with what my friend said, and if you're not hooked by ep 4 to go ahead and stop watching. However, I think you'll be hooked on the first episode.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I actually have no problem with characters being unlikable(Samurai Deeper Kyo and Twelve Kingdoms immediately come to mind) as long as there's growth and development.

Mecha though...hrm...it takes a lot for me to check out mecha...usually multiple recs and/or having it shoved in my hands.

PS

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Urm...kinda only half said what I meant to in the first part(what happens when you start to type then run to take the trash out before you forget) What I meant is, I can easily see why it's a good gateway anime and gets recced as a first anime a lot(though people should stop assuming Firefly fans will love it, because the resemblance begins and ends with "Space Western") because it IS easily accessible, it's just that watching it later on, it was hard to really be involved in it or get attached. Of course, part of that is the hypehypehype.

Re: PS

[bzoppa.livejournal.com]

I totally agree. I like the "gateway" idea, and they are good for people who need to dip a toe into the genre rather than throw Evangelion at them and watch their heads explode.

Personally, I love it when my brain struggles to piece it all together. I've seen RahXephon three times and I'm still fitting pieces of it together. The few times I've watched the first couple of episodes with someone, I've found myself telling them, "You're not supposed to understand yet, just have patience."

Re: PS

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Heh...yeah...it's hard explaining to people that sometimes you have to view the first few episodes of an anime like the first 20 minutes of a movie. Story-arc-lite animes come in useful then. Don't know Evangelion, either.

Re: PS

[bzoppa.livejournal.com]

No Eva either? Hmm...

Okay, after you watch RahXephon, intersperse some other shows in there, then go for Neon Genesis Evangelion. It's similar to an extent, (and as I watched the first episode I really saw why ignoramus-es people claimed RahXephon was a rip-off), but it throws you into the story faster. And it's fucked up, I'm not kidding. Seriously messed up, and that's what makes it so fantastic. Not hentai-messed up, just "let me explode your brain for you"-fucked up.

The order of Evangelion goes:

The series (26 episodes)
Evangelion: Death and Rebirth, which is half a recap (which, believe me, you need—there's no way to follow ANYTHING that happens in the series the first time around, lol)
End of Evangelion

When the last two episodes of Evangelion came out, the director received thousands of letters of hate mail, so he made End of Evangelion. Just watch the series, look at those last two and wonder "wtf?" and then watch the two movies. Then go BACK and rewatch the last two episodes, knowing that the eps are what happens "internally" to resolve the series, while End is the "external" events.

Also: The director never expected it to become so popular in the West. He admitted that, if he'd known, he would have done more research into Christian mythology (or fact, depending on how you read your Bible). He throws together Jesus-Adam-the Crucifiction-Lillith with no regard for the actual stories.

It's brilliant, although there are some people who consider it to be the worst show ever made. I'll leave that up to you ;)

One more suggestion! Serial Experiments Lain. It's only 12-eps, and kind of cyberpunky. Then it goes crazy and ends in absolute brilliance. Not that the beginning isn't good, it just turns off in an insane direction about 6 episodes in.

Oh, I'm so glad to be able to recommend these to you. I've been exclaiming about them for years and when I try to get people to watch they're all, "Ew, anime, whatever." However, you know the genius of Fullmetal Alchemist so I know you'll appreciate these shows.

Re: PS

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Actually, your description kibd of scares me...
Lain is...somewhere...on my list.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

Yay, I am not the only one not in love with Champloo...I like elements of it a lot but have yet to finish it...

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Champloo was nice, but in a non-involved way. It was entertaining, but(aside from a few parts near the end) there was no emotional involvement, or anything more than comfortable viewing.