meganbmoore | Robin Hood: Season 1, eps 1-5 (current BBC series)

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tv: robin hood

Robin Hood: Season 1, eps 1-5 (current BBC series)

Robin, Earl of Huntington, returns home after 5 years in the crusades to find the evil Sheriff of Nottingham overtaxing his people. Robin becomes the leader of a band of outlaws and tries to woo his childhood love, Marian with his new outlaw status. Or something.

You know the drill.

I’ll state this up front: I don’t like Robin. I think he’s a smug gloryhound and don’t like the way he talks down to Marian. He’s also supposed to be smart, but it comes across as utterly ridiculous when they do that. There’s also his whole “no killing ever” policy. Now, sometimes I like it when characters take that stance. It can be very interesting and provide for good character studies but here it’s ridiculous. I could understand it at first, but by the time the sheriff was cutting off tongues, he should have realized that that stance wouldn’t work. It’s supposed to make him seem noble and heroic, but makes him seem like an idiot.

Let me put this in superhero terms. Between Robin’s acrobatics and the flashes of light to let us know how awesome an archer he is, they’re pretty much writing Robin as a superhero anyway. Robin is Captain America. The Sheriff is his archenemy, Red Skull. Guisbourne is Red Skull’s henchman, Crossbones. When Captain America catches Crossbones robbing a bank and shooting everyone inside, he takes him down and turns him over to the police. It isn’t a permanent solution, but it’s a justice system he has faith in, and he knows there will be legal consequences for Crossbones. In Robin Hood’s case, however, Captain America is giving Crossbones back to Red Skull, knowing perfectly well that there will be no punishment and that Red Skull will send Crossbones to rob another bank the next day. It would be different if Robin didn’t have the opportunity to take care of them permanently, but he does. Constantly. And it’s regularly brought up that he doesn’t to make sure we realize how he’s so noble, and emotionally scarred from the crusades, because doesn’t it make him so much more interesting that way?

I think the actor could be charming and likable, but the script makes Robin act superior, and be way too eager for attention for his likability to really come through for me.

However, I like Robin’s men. Much is an idiot, but supposed to be one. I like the quiet Will (though I keep forgetting that he actually can talk) and how Alan is pretty much a conman, and John as the gruff father figure. I absolutely adore the sheriff as a villain. He’s an absurd scenery-chewer and the actor knows it. I am firmly convinced that the only reason Robin has lasted five minutes again him is because if that happens, the show will end. I love Richard Armitage and think the black leather is quite fetching, but Guisbourne isn’t doing a lot for me. I think some spoilers I know for season 2 are a part of that, though.

As an idea, I am utterly in love with Marian. A heroine who is cold and pragmatic, who thinks idealism and heroism are foolish, and who has to be won over to the idea? A lot of her lines are lifted word-for-word from the Jaded and Battle-Scarred Warrior Handbook, and I love it. There’s also the whole Night Watchman business. It clashes a bit with her stated attitudes on heroism and vigilantes, but it also fits, because she isn’t flashy about it and helps people without directly crossing the sheriff most of the time. While the villagers knew about her, she was low key enough that she didn’t make waves, so people weren’t getting their tongues cut out over it. For some reason, though, she isn’t quite clicking with me. I like her ok, and the actress does a good job, but I look at the elements of the character, and I should be madly in love, but I’m not. I think that part of it is that they’re trying a bit hard with the “feminist heroine” bit in that it is a modern take on it, but I think it’s also because they’re really pushing Robin/Marian very hard, and Robin makes it very difficult for me to buy into that pairing. Considering what a big part of the legend Robin/Marian is, that’s not really a good thing.

D’Jaq only appeared in the last episode I watched. I suspect I’ll like her, but I’m a bit leery of the apparent “tomboy and healer” take on the character. I’m also surprised Will clued the others in on her being a girl so quickly.

The show is enjoyable in a campy way, though you really have to ignore most of the costumes and attitudes. Really, I kind of wish it’d stop trying to be serious, and just be fun. I don’t think it’ll ever be a favorite, but I find it entertaining.

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Yeah...I watch Robin Hood purely for the crack. And Djaq. And Richard Armitage.

Let me know once you get past the first couple of episodes of the second season. I've got an awesome fic to rec. ;-)

I'd like it a lot more if I could ignore Robin. Jonas Armstrong is pretty, but that doesn't make up for Robin. Though I do get a kick out of the flashes of light when he fires. Though I'm fairly certain that it isn't supposed to make me laugh maniacally.

I should get the rest of season 1 sometime this week, then I'll likely watch a couple things before season 2.

If you're not spoiled for season two, you might want to be. It ruined any chance I had of wanting to watch the entire series.

The end of the season? Yes, I am. But comments about Marian and D'Jaq made me curious enough to watch.

Fair enough, I haven't finished watching Season 2 myself. It is an awesome story, but was written for Yuletide so unless I can dig out the direct URL it's blocked until Xmas anyway. :)

I couldn't get through this one. I desperately wanted to love it, but Maid Marian with the anachronistic dresses, spackled make-up, and that shitty twit Robin made me weep.

I do love Robin Hood, but I really hate the guy they picked to be Robin. When I saw the first episode, I was like...that can't be him! That guy's unattractive and unlikeable. It must be someone else...nope. No such luck.

I had to train myself to ignore the costuming by episode two. It's worst with Marian at first, but soon her costumes are being outdone by others.

I generally love Robin Hood, character and myth, but...

Robin the character here is just such a stupid, arrogant twat...

(I think Jonas Armstrong is cute, but the scruff is a very bad look for him.)

Hmm...

A few years ago I read something I have yet to find a valid contradiction to: with the possible exception of the Errol Flynn movies (which I have never seen and so I put in the caveat, as did the original author), there has never been a good modern telling of the Robin Hood story. Every Robin Hood movie has been really bad in its own way.

I kinda heard the same things about the Robin Hood TV show, and your review here pretty much reinforces that to me.

It's too bad, really. :\

Well, some other Robin Hoods have had more redeeming value...

"Because, unlike some other Robin Hoods, I can speak with an English accent."

--Robin Hood: Men in Tights

;)

Indeed.

I've yet to see a really good movie version since the Flynns (which are full of historical anachronisms as well, but just have such a charming cast and a delightful swashbuckling feel that it's quite enjoyable), but if you're willing to include TV adaptations, the 1980s UK production "Robin of Sherwood" is a cult classic with good reason. It's uneven at points and ends rather abruptly with plot threads hanging, but it's got some fine actors, a lovely Clannad soundtrack, and introduced a lot of elements that have been a lingering influence on other series and films since it first aired. While there are some individual weak episodes (and occasional iffy bits in otherwise better episodes), the series as a whole is really pretty decent.

I second that opinion, without being able to analyse it so well ^^.

(Sorry to butt in)

I don't know if you're exclusively talking about movies/TV, but I think a couple of the modern novels are pretty good, my favorite being Sherwood by Parke Godwin.

Does anybody like Robin in this show? He's just so... bland. (Except when he's being smug. Then he's smug AND bland.)

It has been a while since I've seen the show, but it's telling that the memorable bits are the ones with Guy and the Sheriff, and the ones where Marion is sneaking around the castle and spying on them. Robin & the outlaws... meh.

I actually heard good things about him before I started watching it. I guess it's the circles you hear about it in.

Those are definitely the more interesting bits. I honestly think part of why I like Robin's men is that he can only make them look better.

The friend who introduced me to the show, and a couple of other mutual friends who were watching it at the same time, were big fans of Robin. However, this girl also knew my tastes well enough to use "Richard Armitage as stalkery antihero in black leather" to lure me in, rather than focusing too much on Robin himself. ;)

I'm mostly with you on preferring the villain scenes, but there are a couple of Robin bits that I did find rather compelling and memorable. (The bit where he's outside Marian's window, and the bit where he's captured Gisburne.)

*waves*

I love Robin, and Robin/Marian. More so in S2 than in S1, though. But then, I love everybody.

As an idea, I am utterly in love with Marian. A heroine who is cold and pragmatic, who thinks idealism and heroism are foolish, and who has to be won over to the idea? A lot of her lines are lifted word-for-word from the Jaded and Battle-Scarred Warrior Handbook, and I love it. There’s also the whole Night Watchman business. It clashes a bit with her stated attitudes on heroism and vigilantes, but it also fits, because she isn’t flashy about it and helps people without directly crossing the sheriff most of the time. While the villagers knew about her, she was low key enough that she didn’t make waves, so people weren’t getting their tongues cut out over it. For some reason, though, she isn’t quite clicking with me. I like her ok, and the actress does a good job, but I look at the elements of the character, and I should be madly in love, but I’m not. I think that part of it is that they’re trying a bit hard with the “feminist heroine” bit in that it is a modern take on it, but I think it’s also because they’re really pushing Robin/Marian very hard, and Robin makes it very difficult for me to buy into that pairing.

*nods* As I'd mentioned on AIM the other night, I was a little dubious about her character at first for much the same reasons -- goodness knows I have no objection to swashbuckling action heroines on general principles, but between her and Robin (and the dire costuming) the show started on the wrong foot with me by hitting a little too hard on the "heroes with anachronistic modern, enlightened attitudes" note. But I gritted my teeth and tried to tell myself they were going for camp-and-fantasy rather than a serious period piece, and eventually managed to get to where I could deal with it. For me, what helped a lot was that they at least made enough of a nod to the mores of the time that she has to keep her Xena side secret, and nobody suspects the Night Watchman could be anything but a man; I also liked the conflict between her dutiful-daughter and vigilante-social-crusader roles. But what really won me over in the end was just her general level-headed good sense, even in a crisis. (Have you made it to the episode where she's confronted by a random teenage peasant boy who wants to kill her? That was the big "OK, she's officially cool" moment for me, even if I still never really bought into the Robin/Marian ship...

Where she points out that it won't do him any good to kill her, and then turns her back on him? Yeah, I really liked that part. The followup scene with her telling Robin to make sure the boy wins and Robin pretends to be the boy is the closest I've come to thinking Robin might be good enough for her. I think the modern bit is really where I get hung up with the character. Her position and storyline are just my thing, but-while nodding to the mores of the time-they're approaching it in a modern way, instead of from the perspective of the time.

Yep, that was the one! As for Djaq, to me she ends up coming across more as a scientist rather than the Token Healer Chick -- tho' admittedly we tend to see the medical subset of her knowledge come into use a bit more often, since with the outlaws' lifestyle that sort of thing is more of an everyday need than her advanced knowledge of chemistry...

*nods*

D'Jaq only showed up in the last episode I saw (which is actually the same one we're discussing), so there hasn't really been enough time to get a handle on her character, though she seems fun.

I loathe this Robin and don't care much for this version of Marian, either.

It really seems wrong to be rooting for the Sheriff and Sir Guy of Gisborne in any version of the Robin Hood story, but I can't help it when it comes to the BBC show.

In conclusion: Richard Armitage.

ETA: The big S2 Sir Guy spoiler actually made me like his character better.

As mch as I like Armitage and approve of the leather, I'm having a bit of a problem with Guy as a character. But I think that's because I know how this thing with Marian ends.

The Sheriff may be my favorite. Really, Robin is so stupid that you wonder if the sheriff is indulging him.

ETA for ETA: Right now he's a bit wishy washy (it would work if it played more as internal conflict that unexplained hesitation) so I kinda get that.

You get more inner conflict as the series goes on. Really, part of what makes his character the most fascinating for me is that he's a villain who knows he's a bad guy, and occasionally regrets it, without ever seeming like he's going to change his ways despite those faint glimmerings of conscience. The Sheriff is just pure sadistic evil, but Guy, despite all of the horrible things he's done, occasionally shows flashes of humanity. And while his backstory certainly doesn't excuse the things he's done, it does give him enough depth that you can see how it helped bring him to this point, and imagine how he might have turned out a little better under different circumstances. That sort of thing tends to be much more intriguing to me than pure unalloyed one-note evil, or angsty misunderstood woobies who just need a good hug to be brought to the side of the angels. (Don't get me wrong, I love watching the Sheriff, but there's no intrinsic conflict in his character: he's bad, he knows it, and he revels in it. He's endlessly watchable because the actor does such a grand job of chewing the scenery, but the lack of conflict keeps his character less interesting because there's no real room for growth or change there: he is what he is and he'll stay that way. Guy is conflicted, and I think not entirely mentally/emotionally sound, so there's always that little element of uncertainty that I find compelling in a character.)

(Mind you, the black leather doesn't hurt, either!)

I really love Robin (and Marian), but I know a lot of people don't. I remember liking him more and more towards the end of S1 and definitely in S2, so you might find him more bearable, or you might not. I do think the show as a whole is better in S2. (Gisborne being shirtless a lot doesn't hurt. At all.)

And hee, I love Robin's men. Allan in particular.

I like Marian, just not as much as I want to. Robin...we'll see.

I couldn't stand the show. I got a few minutes into the second episode and turned the show off, never to return. The martial arts was too hilarious, and not the kind that would intrigue me to watch.

I'm curious if you've tried out Merlin, the 2008 family show? I watched the first couple episodes while playing games on the computer because my mom likes it. I'd love for you to rip on that for a while.

The actrobatics are one of many absurd things about Robin.

I'll likely check Merlin out when it gets to DVD.

In the original story, Robin Hood killed Guy of Gisbourne and cut off his head. So. Um. Nothing else of value to say? Except that when I watched the first couple episodes, I couldn't understand why I didn't find it very interesting, and now I understand! He's irritating!

Ever read Jennifer Roberson's Robin Hood duology?

I've been watching for the Roberson duology at UBSes, but haven't found it yet.

Robin becomes more of a sweetheart as the show goes on - but I'm pleased with the way he hasn't been *totally* idealised, as he has in every other version I've seen. I think Jonas has done a fantastic job because he is aware of Robin's flaws, and he communicates them very well to the audience.

Oh, Marian. It took me a long time to like her, but the minute that I accepted she was a Mary-Sue, the whole thing was a lot more fun. :)

We never get to see enough of Will and Djaq, I think. But the glimpses we do see make them fascinating characters that should have been explored, if the writers weren't so obsessed with pushing Robin/Marian and Save-King-Richard.

This show is totally campy, but it makes me so happy because it is generally angst free - IDK. I've had enough of shows like Supernatural that lay emotion on very strongly. And this doesn't really push any kind of ethical/
~~I think I'm just totally biased towards British entertainment.~~

If you like this kind of crazy!entertainment you should try Merlin. It doesn't even really try to be serious at all. The first two or so episodes are a bit pathetic, but it gets much, MUCH better.

Hmm...I'd say Robin is more idealized, really. Before he was the ideal of the freedom loving rebel. Now he's pushed as the ideal of the superhero cliche.

I hate this one even more than Robin Hood: Prince of Thieves (which is the reason why, if Kevin Costner and I ever meet in a cellar, only one of us is leaving). That this offensive tat was produced by the BBC only makes it worse, Costner's lot at least had the excuse of ignorance (and I love Men In Tights for mocking their stupidity).

Best modern version was Robin of Sherwood, with Michael Praed. Jason Connery was never as good. I know the magic side of it was totally wrong, but they made it work and at least they never made Robin an annoying, self-obsessed loser. Also, there was a very hot Saracen.

Basically, I wish people would stop making it if they can't get it right. This is a national legend of great importance and they are turning it into rubbish.

My feelings on bad Robin Hood remakes are second only to my feelings when someone twists the legend of Arthur (and Marion Zimmer Bradley had also better avoid dark cellars).

Men in Tights was very fun, and I agree about Robin of Sherwood, though I haven't seen the Connery part yet. This one has some interesting ideas in it, but Robin himself is a hard pill to swallow.

Marion Zimmer Bradley...I read one of her Avalon books and despised it so much I essentially vowed to never touch her books again. It dealt with Guenevere, Morgan and Arthur being reincarnated over and ever, and for about 500 pages, said that the Morgan character was awesome in every incarnation and the Guenevere character pathetic because, with the religions of their best known incarnations, how could they be otherwise?

I gave the pilot a look and couldn't get past the RELEVANT! TOPICAL! IRAQ! WAR! REFERENCES! WHICH ARE MEANINGFUL! And haven't we, as a people, found better ways to get across that someone is a villain than to dress them in entirely black leather?

Plus, those arrow captions are annoying. Man, stop that!

Hey! We put good guys in black leather now, too!

The arrow captions need to die.

Yeah, and notice the Sheriff doesn't wear black leather. I think Guy's outfit is less about screaming "VILLAIN!" than it is about screaming "SEXY VILLAIN!". ;)

The arrow captions need to be sent a letter telling them to meet with the 3D captions from Fringe. Then when the 3D captions get there, they're all "wait, I thought you sent me a letter telling me to meet you here!"

Then the building explodes.

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Robin Hood: Season 1, eps 1-5 (current BBC series)

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You saying that makes me think of this:

Re: You saying that makes me think of this:

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