Fruits Basket Vol 19

[meganbmoore]

After miss_dianposted on the series the other day, I went and looked at the first few volumes again.  In some ways, the art has come a very, very long ways(and it started good) but I can't help but notice with this volume that some characters are starting to look alike.  Tohru's father, I think, is supposed to look a bit like Kyo, but Momiji in this volume almost looked like a blond Kyo, and when Kagura showed up, I thought she was Kimi at first.  I've also been having to do doubletakes for a bit now with Shigure and Hatori, when Shigure is wearing a suit.

That said, Natsuki Takaya is, flatout, one of the best visual storytellers I've encountered.  I don't really put the emphasis on art that others seems to.  I get (usually) why there is the emphasis, but I'm more about story and characters than art, so when I hear anything along the lines of "I can take a bad story if there's good art" or "I have a hard time getting into a manga/comic if the art isn't my thing" I'm utterly scandalized.  (And then I make myself a hypocrite with things like Bride of the Water God, where the plot is so thin but the art so pretty...but both the art and the plot are amazingly...well...mythic.)  My main concern is that the art competently tells the story, doesn't hurt my eyes, and is easy to follow.  Most artists seem to slap pretty pictures on a page in relative order, and assume you'll follow.  Something about Natsuki Takaya's art, however, literally pulls from one place to the other, so that usually, you'd probably have to actually try to read it in the wrong order.  Even just the word ballons are arranged to pull your eyes in the right direction, so that you can follow the story easily, even when the words aren't in the conventional order.

But, anyway, on to the actual book.

It seems like a lot happened in this volume, so I'll break it down by chapter.

Ch 108:  Despite how much I love Tohru, she can be so naive and childlike at times that I want to shake her.  Not hard, but just enough to get her attention so I can explain the world to her a bit.  Her fears about forgetting her mother are heartbreaking(and the "mother hit by car" hits a little too close to home for me, and always has) but the fact that the memories will eventually fade, especially as she startes to love others, is a part of life.  Shigure's words to her about how the other members of the Zodiac are secretly glad that Kyo will be locked away are, on the surface extremely cruel, they're also true words that need to be put out in the world, and I also tend to think that he was trying to push her into action.  And then Takaya has to go and be extra evil and remind us that, unless they fall for another Zodiac member or prefer people of their own sex, the cousins don't really get to touch or comfort the people they love.  (Yes, Kyo/Tohru turns me to mush and always has.  At least Rin and Haru get to do more than slight touching.)

Ch 109:  A fallout from the last chapter, in some ways, as it focuses on the loss of Tohru's parents.  Even though he says its to keep Kyoko and Tohru connected to him, I can't help but think Tohru's grandfather is just starting to slip.  Even sadder, though, was the talk about how little!Tohru started talking like her father to convince people she really was her daughter.  And again with the "oh, look, if you don't fall for another Zodiac member, no touchy-huggy stuff for you."

Ch 110:  I'm sorry, my brain is lightly broken from the fact that Ayame and Mine is actually canon.  It's like that crack pairing you thought would never happen did.  But how do they manage certain things, as they're living together?  Never mind, I suspect they're kinky enough to find a way around it.  Mine probably likes the snake, too.  I suspect that, when I sit down and actually reread the series, I'll be amazed by all of Ayame's character growth through the series, and it was nice to see the beginning of his realizing there are people beyond him who exist in the world.  Poor Machi, though.  She just isn't built to withstand all that.  And did Kyo only just realize he has hormones where Tohru is concerned?

Ch 111:  A lot of this chapter felt like an apology for the sheer angst of the earlier chapters, with all the cousins getting together for their barbecue, and checking in with everyone.  Momiji, as I mentioned before, is starting to look like a blond Kyo, but he  sure doesn't act like Kyo.  Hiro is actually learning manners.  (Probably worried about his sister picking up the bad manners.)  Haru can still be spacey.  Kisa's actually figuring out how to talk to people.  (Kyo, stop looking so grumpy all the time.)  I also like that Momiji is the one who finally told Kyo to do something about Tohru before he lost his chance.  (Yes, Kyo, everyone can tell.  What is it with males named Kyo [including with syllables following the "Kyo"] in manga having entire casts talk about his romantic feelings, regardless of genre?)  I remain unable to have anything resembling positive feelings towards Akito.

Ch 112:  This chapter was mostly Yuki/Machi, which is cute, but not overly interesting to me.  I (somewhat passively) like Machi, but she's one of the very few female characters where I can agree with the mass fandom's opinion that she seems to be there mostly to be a love interest. (Stop approaching fiction as "male=hero, female=love interest," world.)

Ch 113:  And here we finally (properly) meet Kakeru's girlfriend, Komaki, whose father died in the same car crash that killed Kyoko.  I have to wonder if anyone was actually surprised that she's basically Tohru, if a little more energetic.  I'm glad that Kakeru finaly talked, and apologized, to Tohru.  *disapproves of meanness to Tohru*

It seems I continue to be lukewarm to Yuki's storyline.  Mostly, it, and the characters involved, still seem to be there to give Yuki something to do that isn't being a third wheel in Kyo/Tohru or connected to the family.  I like the little mini-cast he was given, I'm just not overly interested in it.

Comments

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I am one of the people who (usually) can't like a manga if the art does not appeal (Hanadan is the only exception and I think only because (a) I knew the story from other mediums first and (b) the art does get nice later). It's the same as not being able to like a book, no matter the story, if the writing style is horrible or a movie if the acting is no good...

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Yup. I can understand it to a degree, it's just completely alien to me. Too many good things out there to skip them because the pictures aren't pretty enough for me. (In contrast, I can't get past bad prose unless it's something to mock, like cassie Edwards.)

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

Is the Hanadan anime any good?

[salimbol.livejournal.com]

I'd say the Hanadan anime is reasonable: it follows the manga storylines almost exactly, and it genuinely gets what makes the characters tick. And the voice cast is very good. On the minus side, it slows down the story a great deal (the manga storyline has a huge amount of energy) and presses the angst button a lot more than it should. Plus I've always thought the choice of delicate classical music and wispy pastel tones a really odd choice for HYD. Overall, it's worth a try; it won't be to everyone's taste, but then neither is the manga.

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

Thanks very much for the info :) I don't know how closely the Taiwanese and Japanese dorama adaptations follow the manga, but I liked both doramas. The Taiwanese one especially, because I liked their F4 better. I may check this out, after I finish Rurouni Kenshin ^o^

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

YOU'RE READING RUROKEN????

YAY!!!

*loves it unconditionally*

Though neither the characters or the pairing is my absolute favorite, I tend to think Kaoru and Kenshin's relationship-both the romantic and platonic parts-is one of the best done relationships I've seen in manga, for all that's it's essentially a mindless shounen action series, though their storyline doesn't really come together until the last leg.

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

Sorry I meant that I am watching Rurouni Kenshin :D The mixture of anime/manga/dorama discussion here is getting me mixed up, LOL. I have seen 1 episode of the anime and it looks very good.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Ah. The anime is pretty good. But once they get back from Kyoto, just stop watching and go read the manga.

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

LOL. Thanks for the heads up. Will see how I like it then. I already have all the anime up until end of Season 3 (which, correct me if I'm wrong, is the whole serial, right?).

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Yup. 3 seasons, 2 OVA series(the first is good, but loses some of its meaning without the framind series...the second is, as far as I know, universally reviled by those who have read the manga) and a movie(fun, but nothing special.) The first 2 seasons follow the first 2 arcs of the manga fairly faithfully, with fillers. The third season, though, is completely original material, and there's a lot of OOC stuff, especially for Kaoru (and one terribly facepalmy bit for Sano.) There are some good bits, but the short version is that it got the anime cancelled (as I understand things) before they got to animate the final arc.

Actually, there are a couple really good eps there, if you want when you reach that point, I can try to see which ones they are.

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

Actually, there are a couple really good eps there, if you want when you reach that point, I can try to see which ones they are.
That'd be good. Thanks. I'll let you know when I do get to season 3.

What a pity that the 3rd season got the whole anime cancelled. Heh. Would have liked to see the anime follow through till the final arc.

What are OOC stuff?

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

OOC=Out Of Character

[salimbol.livejournal.com]

You're welcome. I'd definitely give it a try; if you liked the doramas then you'll probably like the same story in anime form. Be warned: if you don't know the manga character designs, then the look of the whole thing might be a bit of a shock to the system, is all. As for the doramas themselves: the Taiwanese one is about 90% faithful to the manga up to the last couple of episodes, where they had to make their own ending because the manga hadn't finished at that point; the Japanese one is less faithful, as the writers basically took bits and pieces from all 36 volumes of the manga and recombined them very cleverly in a different order (which means they're often divorced from linear characterisation, of course).
I like the Taiwanese F4 better as well *grin*. (Hopefully not just 'cause they're prettier.)
And - Kenshin? Yay!

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

If the manga character designs are anything like the anime, I think I can still handle it :D The boys' hair (ie. Doumyoji) is a bit off-putting and I am so glad that the Taiwanese dorama did better in physically presenting him than the Japanese dorama did. Like, seriously, I had a heck of a trouble buying the Japanese F4 (especially in the first season). I think this was also because I watched the Taiwanese dorama first, and fell in love with it, hence I kind of had similar expectations of the F4 boys from the Japanese dorama :D

[valkyriesailor.livejournal.com]

If you already went though the manga, the anime designs are a bit better than first volumes of the manga - in my opinion. Next with the soundtrack the whole design has a feeling of a soap~ Since not all is like in the manga, my advice would be to watch it like it's another story. I guarantee you'll fall in love with HyD all over again. ^^
Oh, I'm so glad I'm not the only one who founds the Taiwanese dorama better! Not only from the story, but the character of Doumyouji was really so well made there! Next to that the Japanese dorama... well, I really don't like to talk bad about Jun, but I couldn't really see him as the leader of the F4. He was the shortest of them all, and then his character is hyperactive all the time~ it was like watching a flea with inferiority complex jumping up and down.

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

Since not all is like in the manga, my advice would be to watch it like it's another story.
Ah, thank you for the HYD anime rec :) I'll keep that in mind!

He was the shortest of them all, and then his character is hyperactive all the time~ it was like watching a flea with inferiority complex jumping up and down.
LOL. LOL. So funny. It wasn't that extreme for me with Jun being Doumyoji. But I did adore Shun as Rui the most, out of all the F4. I did make a post about my horror concerning the Japanese F4 in here: http://miss-dian.livejournal.com/22802.html#cutid1

Putting that aside, though, I generally prefer Korean and Taiwanese guys as opposed to Japanese. Perhaps it is because 1) Japanese actors tend to be smaller built than Korean/Taiwanese, and 2) I find eye-brow shaping that Japanese actors do kind of scary. Like Kame, for example. He's super talented and I like him as an actor, but his eyebrows never fail to make me go WTF :D BUT.. I acknowledge that a lot of people love Kame physically, so I guess to each his own.

[valkyriesailor.livejournal.com]

About Hyd I'll reply in the post you mentioned.
Yes, I agree that Japanese tend to be smaller than Korean / Taiwanese. (Maybe that's why by Arashi's Asian Tour Nino was told to be a grade schooler, and Sho as a men over 30. XD). For a while this boyish style is an eye-catch, but in the long time it gets borring if you're an adult (and don't have shota-complex XD). That's why I began to look out for 'older' actors, and those, who doesn't have a connection with Johnny's. So I watched some Oda Yuji, Tsutsumi Shinichi, and Tsumabuki Satoshi doramas. Oh, definitely Satoshi! If you haven't seen anything from him yet, you should! He is a great actor, even if his build is a bit breakable.
Kame is not a favourite of mine~ I have the same feeling with him as Nino: they have ethiop-origins. If I need to choose, it would be Jin or Koki.

[fmanalyst.livejournal.com]

Bad art can kick me out, but mediocre art doesn't bother me if the stories and characters are good.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

It's just extremely rare that the art is bad enough for me to let it affect me. Off the top of my head, just Rob Liefeld and Skottie young for US comics, and Getbackers for manga.

[desdenova.livejournal.com]

I used to be fairly indifferent to art in comics, but I've found that as I've read more and more, I've become a lot less tolerant of "bad" art (and correspondingly more impressed by good art). For me, it's the same as quality of prose in a text-only story: good craftmanship--whether graphical or prose--has a strong effect on how much I enjoy, or don't enjoy, a story.

Re: Fruits Basket: I agree with you about Yuki's plotline. It really does make me happy that he's grown so much that he can make friends of his own, but when I'm reading, I mostly just find the student council stuff to be distraction from the awesome angst-a-thon of the main storyline.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

In all honesty, I think she wrote herself into a corner with Yuki. At the beginning, there was the Yuki/Yohru/Kyo triangle, and Yuki being the one all the others cousins adored and got strength from. By the time the series reached the teens, though, he was very much a third wheel in Kyo/Tohru, and it was also obvious that, while there may be a romantic undertone to his feelings for Tohru, they aren't at the core, romantic. In addition, Tohru had, by then, long since taken over the role of giving the Sohmas strength and acceptance, and much more convincingly. (In all honesty, none of the cousins' adoration for Yuki ever made any sense to me. It almost seemed like they just thought he was great because he was the rat.)

And so, with Yuki on the verge of being little more than a glorified minor character, instead of one of the three main characters he started out as, Yuki was given a token best friend and girlfriend, and a side plot of his own to play in as the lead, without pushing the love triangle. I can appreciate what she's doing and why, but I can't make myself more than passively like/be amused by/root for any of it.

ETA: As time goes by, I find myself more appreciative of good art, but also more and more willing to put up with bad art for good story. The exception is things that are just truly ugly(Skottie Young) or things that are surface-pretty, but terrible in terms of actual "Art"(Greg Land)

[desdenova.livejournal.com]

ETA: UGH, Greg Land. I suppose "surface-pretty" is a good word for his stuff, but I wouldn't call it "good" comic-book art.

When I talk about good or bad art in a comic, it's not really about the attractiveness of the figures. What I mean is all the ways an artist draws the material to tell the story. Figure-drawing, yes, but also paneling, page design, color & shading. So if comic art is "bad" in this regard, it really prevents me from seeing a story as "good," overall. The best I can say is, "this plot and characters could have been good, if handled by somebody who knew what they were doing."

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Greg Land(and a lot of the currently popular artists) draws pages that, at a glance, are stunning, but when you look closer, you realize there's 1 main picture meant to catch your eye, usually unnaturally posed if its a person(and in land's case, usually obviously copied) and other pictures as filler. It's there to be pretty and make you stare at one piece of the page, not tell the story. Even really, really good artists like Steve Epting, though, seem to be falling prey to that. (But he remains and excellent storyteller, and more than passes all the other requirements, so i'm not really complaining.)

BTW, Land, IMO, is a terrible artist. It was seeing some of his OA back in the CrossGen days and realizing that he barely bothered to draw more than the figured and seeing all the spaces where he lightboxed things in, as well as one hideously lightboxed panel in Sojourn that made me really start paying attention to art beyond whether or not it was pretty.

[cerusee.livejournal.com]

I pay attention to both writing and art when I read, but one's got to be pretty bad for me to reject a comic if the other's good. I tend to put a bit more emphasis on writing than art, because I am prejudiced and think writing's better for narrative than art...but I'm not sure I should, because I'm just now beginning to understand just how much a skillful artist can prop up iffy writing; what I often sum up as "good art; bad writing" is art that COULD do a better job of pairing with iffy writing, if the artist was...well, a better narrative artist.

What I am often looking for, and which does not require either writing or art to be brilliant, but usually does not happen if either one is awful, is the nifty fusion purpose in art and writing that makes a comic worth telling as a comic and not in another medium.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that's why I put a lot more emphasis on visual STORYTELLING than in how pretty the pictures are. It's graphic storytelling, not slapping down pretty pictures to go with words
average linework with great flow is much better to me than randomly assorted pretty pictures.

[cerusee.livejournal.com]

I had an artist friend who tended to fixate on the art, and reject comics she thought had bad art out of hand. She did kinda get it, though: the final item on her checklist for comic book art was always, "Does it support the story?" I still use that as a guidepost today, and I will cut a book slack if everything's only so-so, but it's got that synergy thing going on.

[salimbol.livejournal.com]

I'd second this motion! While I like pretty artwork as much as the next person, I'm willing to put up with quite a lot of iffyness if the procession of panels and placement of art on a page is telling a good story. Actually, three of my very favourite manga start out with fairly ugly artwork, but they tell one hell of a story. I'm thinking of Basara here among other things, Megan; I remember finding that artwork almost off-putting at the beginning, but the story was just that compelling that I had to keep reading.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I'v e never really understood the huge issues people have with Basara's art. It's not that good at a glance, but once you really look at it, it's beautiful in its way.

I know Hana Yori Dango is one of the other favorites...what's the other?

[salimbol.livejournal.com]

Oh, I love the artwork now; it just took some getting used to. I think if you're accustomed to neat, clean lines in manga artwork then Basara's a bit of a shock to the system. It's got that fly-away/sketchy quality, after all, and the pictures aren't 'tidy'. But it's got tremendous vitality and expressiveness, and I think it's pretty amazing.
As to other favourites: well, you know I like SDK *grin* - but I've never had any problems with the artwork in that! One of my other favourites is 'Please Save My Earth', which has got fairly messy artwork and slightly malformed-looking characters early on. Once again, the storytelling itself got me past that.

[cerusee.livejournal.com]

Oh, and, I think Takaya's art is very good at conveying the story she is telling. She's certainly gotten stronger over the course of the series (for an example of how much simple practice can help in improving visual storytelling, look at Sluggy Freelance; Pete Abrams was a godawful cartoonist when he started the comic, and while he's not exactly Naoki Urusawa now, he's clearly learned how to draw, and how to illustrate the story he wants to tell). It's sometimes very hard for me to tell, though, because I love the story and the characters very much, and what you love is beautiful.

[chomiji]

Momiji is growing up very nicely ... and it's not like I'm usually into little blond boys ... .

Yes. Ayame/Mine is most definitely canon! And although it's very amusing to imagine what their, um, domestic bliss must be like, I do think that the pictures of Ayame resting his forehead on Mine's shoulder while he confesses what an awful boor he's been - just his forehead, because that's as close as he can get to falling into her arms - is one of the saddest things in the series. Ayame is usually completely un-self-pitying and bouyant, and to see him so much adrift is really unsettling and miserable.

In fact, between that and the scene with Kyo and Tohru with the laundry, this has some of the most moving visuals yet.

The pictures do get confusing - her simple, streamlined style makes differentiating people very tough.

I am so very bored with Yuki's part of the story. I know you think I'm a total slashing machine, meganb-san, but I really do think it would have been so much more interesting if Yuki and Kakeru had been of an inclination to fall for each other, because Kakeru is a real person. As it is now, we have two rather mush-brained girls instead. Tohru is enough fluffy-girl for the whole series - I love her, but a little of that goes a long way. If Takaya had to bring in other girls, why couldn't they be as interesting characters as Kakeru is?

(For that matter, Takaya could have just resisted the urge to pair Arisa Uotani and Saki Hanajima up with Kureno and Kazuma, who are so much older that it really freaks me out ... Kyoko and Katsuma were bad enough. Hanajima would be sweet with Yuki and Uo would be fun with Kakeru. And Kureno and Shishou could go find women nearer their own age!)

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I think you have yourself painted in your head as more of a slash machine than you are in my head. Honestly, I almost never think of it unless you bring it up. (The exceptions are a few times when I'm reading something and there's a slash pairing and I think "Cho might like them," pretty much.)

Kakeru, though, is as much the token best friend as Machi is the token girlfriend, really. The main difference is that he was given more scenes, largely as a sounding board for Yuki explaining his feelings for Tohru, and then the Komaki storyline. I can't make myself be remotely interested in either of them. They were created to give Yuki his own story, and for that I'm grateful, but that's about it. I like both just fine, but forget about them when they aren't around.

I think the thing with the visuals is that, since the beginning of the series, she's cleaned up a lot of the extra lines and seems to be focusing more on blacks and clean lines, instead of all t he little lines and greys. They're still there, but not as much as they used to do. It's kinda like with Clamp: If they were to put Doumeki and Kurogane in the same outfit and the same book, we'd only really have Doumeki's eyes to tell them apart. For that matter, Tomoyo looks like a smaller Himawari to me at times. (I'm saying this about FB from memory since I read the book before work and left it home, so I can't look and check, and thinking mostly of a couple shots of Kyo that stand out and when we first see Momiji from the front.)

I think we get some of the most moving visuals yet in this volume because Takaya is piling on the angst. Aren't there only 3-4 volumes left?

I've been pretty much rooting for Ayame/Mine since it was made pretty clear the stuff with Shigure was pretty much all to annoy people, but not really worried or thinking about it. Their relationship even without the romantic aspect was already obviously deep enough that falling madly in love with someone else probably wouldn't affect it much.

Uo and Hana with older guys actually doesn't bother me that much. Probably because, well, they're both extremely mature in their ways. In some ways, I think Uo is more mature than Kureno. Wasn't Katsuma Kyoko's teacher? (It's been a while since I read that volume...I may be getting my shoujo's mixed up. The Japanese, though, have a really big-and often concerning-thing for student/teacher pairings.)

Are we really supposed to take Hana/Kazuma seriously, though? I haven't read scans(I never do for shoujo, and only a few shounen) so I don't know how it turns out(well, 98%~ of it...) but that, so far, seemed to mostly be to freak Kyo out.

Of course, Takaya seems borderline obsessed with pairing everyone off, so who knows. I think she figures that she makes all their lives so cruddy and piles so much angst on that that she feels the need to make sure they all have someone in the end.

[chomiji]

I know Kakeru's function is to be Yuki's sounding board, but he actually has at least as much character development as Kagura or Ritsu! She brought them together gradually enough that we got a lot of him before Yuki started confiding in him.

Yes, there are 23 tankoubon volumes, so we've only got 4 left. Vol. 20 ships July 1, according to Amazon.

The character summary information on Wikipedia (gee, we know how accurate that is ... ) implies that a relationship continues between Hana and Kazuma. And yes, Katsuma was Kyoko's teacher, although he was a student-teacher at the time. That's part of why I'm cross about it - imbalance of power in a sexual relationship is an ethical squick for me. When I do find it hot, I hate myself for it. Although Takaya does depict it with great tenderness ... I got all squishy when Katsuma was calling her "Miss No-Eyebrows."

Uo and Kureno - maybe. He has been very sheltered - from everything but Akito. But Kazuma has been running the dojo and serving as a martial arts instructor and Kyo's foster-father - I don't think Hanajima, who has been sheltered from everything but peer nastiness, equals him in maturity level. She's naturally quiet and not bubbly, and of course she's had to deal with others' feelings impinging on her - but that doesn't equal maturity in terms of dealing with a relationship.

---

>> I think you have yourself painted in your head as more of a slash machine than you are in my head.<<

Thanks for that reminder! I'll try not to bring it up ... I think it was just on my mind recently because I think I've uncovered another piece to the puzzle, at least in terms of what I feel like fic'ing. Maybe I'll post about it on mine.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Considering what I've read on wiki for anime and manga, it's entirely possible that's based on "Hana joked about it that one time, and they were talking and smiling in the epilogue, so they're totally getting married." If needed, I can accept a mutual interest a few years down the road(and based purely on their personalities, I think I can see how they'd be compatible), but at this point, the idea makes my eyebrows reach my hairline. Uo/Kazuma I have an easier time with, though I freely admit that my desire for him to be rescued-physically and emotionally-from Akito may color my views.

I generally dislike the student/teacher pairings(1 exception, off the top of my head), and haven't read a lot of manga/watched a LOT of popular dramas because of it. I do, though, often seem to like it (in canon) in military settings. In the 2 off the top of my head, one (Sam and Jack in Stargate) makes it very clear that nothing has happened BECAUSE of the power imbalance, and also clear that the emotional control has always been in the subordinate's hands, and in the other (Mustang and Hawkeye in FMA) their positions are almost a technicality and, again, control of the relationship (in other areas as well) is in the subordinate's hands.

The thing is,though, that in those two cases, both parties are adults, and were there to be any pressure, the subordinate would be in a position to say no and properly report it (though if I ever thought the superior WOULD, I'd dislike the very idea pairing...character context makes a huge difference...it's why the idea of Kougaiji taking advantage of Doku or Yaone either one makes me giggle) but student/teacher will, at best, involve early 20s/17~, but often an even greater age gap. And, very simply, I can't accept the idea that a teenager in that situation could ever make the choice of their own free will, even if they thought they were.

ETA: Also, Like Kakeru and Machi, I tend to forget about Kagura and Ritsu unless they show up/are mentioned. With all four, it's not that they arn't worth remembering and I like all just fine, they just aren't developed enough to stand out among all the others.

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

**adds to Memories for the spoilers**

How many episodes are there in the manga?

Re: Tohru. Agree that sometimes you can't help but want to shake her for being so naive. I think there is a really appealing notion in Japan that girls should be naive and elf-like and innocent. All blended together with the concept of "kawaii" I must say it gets on my nerves sometimes.

Non-related, one of the things I really love in the anime and not present in the manga is the opening/closing songs. Both are so sweet, easy listening, and beautiful! :)

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

The anime is 26 eps.

I love Tohru, and (unlike many heroines in manga I don't bother to read, just like I don't read a lot of the alpha jerk ones, and they tend to get paired in shoujo) it makes sense for her to be the way she is, and serves a valuable purpose in the story.

When I started reading manga, I was only a few years older than Tohru is now, and just in love with the idea of being able to influence people that much. Now I'm almost technically old enough to be her mother and want to wrap her up and cradle her like a little bird who hasn't learned how to fly yet, and give her a few lectures about flying.

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

I actually meant the manga, not the anime. Are they both 26 eps?

Re: what are alpha jerks in mangas, out of curiousity? I've only read Fruits Basket as far as mangas go.

...and just in love with the idea of being able to influence people that much.
Me too, that was one of the things I really like about Tohru.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I'm not sure how long the manga is, but I think it ends in the early 20s.

Alpha jerks in manga: Hmm...in all honesty, I've started and dropped so much shoujo manga over the years that I've forgotten most of them.

Hmm...if you're looking to read more manga (I'm not sure most shounen would agree with you) I can make a list of the ones I like, or if you make a post, I can send people your way. (You are starting with one of the best, though.)

For Tohru, the thing about shoujo is that most of it is designed to do two things:

1) If you're young enough, be the dream you want where the cute guys like like and you have all these admirable qualities and flaws aren't really held against you.

2) Cater to your inner 13-year-old who remembers wanting those things. My inner 13-year-old is kinda of picky, but quite joyous when reached.

[miss-dian.livejournal.com]

Hmm...if you're looking to read more manga (I'm not sure most shounen would agree with you) I can make a list of the ones I like, or if you make a post, I can send people your way.
Thanks for the offer :) I'll do a post asking for recs of anime and manga, explaining my preference and all. This Friday, hopefully.

Speaking of recs, I have a couple of anime movie myself that I'd love to rec to people. **puts in To Do list**

[valkyriesailor.livejournal.com]

Hm... I really should read the FB manga till the end now~ just can't seem to find the time for it.
About Yuki~ first I thought he will be the together with Tohru, since he seemed to open up only to her, while Kyo had no problems talking to others. As the story goes on I know that it's a Kyo/Tohru, but somehow just couldn't accept more than some brother-sister connection. I liked how they solved it in the anime. The end is like living together as a happy family. Somehow, withouth romance the story becomes more pure~ (if that's the right word) and sweet.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

For some reason, the idea of Yuki/Tohru always bothered me, even before I realized Kyo could be a potential love interest for Tohru. I've never really been able to completely put my finger on why, though.

[valkyriesailor.livejournal.com]

Well, think about it like that: WHO could be a good partner for Yuki? I really can't even image a character that would go with his~ in general the idea of Yuki in love is somehow... well, quite hard to image. ^^"
Maybe the fact, that they live in one house is more like family, then some romance interest. Next to that Kyo goes in-and out of the house, like the cat he is, and then there are those roof-dates~

[shiegra.livejournal.com]

I only ever got the sense that Machi was a 'love interest' character in the fact that if she wasn't Yuki's love interest, she never would have been explored. I really like her character.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

My problem with Machi (thoughit isn't actually Machi herself, but the plotline in general) is that we don't get her story through her eyes and in her words, but related by her brother. Ditto with Kobaki.