2 blood pressure raising links

[meganbmoore]

Yes, please, please, please save the puppies.  But not at the expense of the woman whose husband beats her with a baseball bat in front of her child.  (Example above not in link.)

ALSO!!!

Did you know that raping a person is no different from stealing food when you're hungry? Someone please point out to the writer that men can be raped too.  I want to see his reaction.

(first link courtesy of lesbiassparrow, second courtesy of coffeeandink.)

Comments

[lesbiassparrow.livejournal.com]

Both the post in the second link and the comments turn my stomach...

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

...so not touching the second link.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

But you will not have the proper depths of rage if you don't!

I think "from a Darwinian standpoint" or some such was even used.

[lyssie.livejournal.com]

Honey. I've been around fandom long enough that I've read some OTF Wanks where the original wanker was claiming rape was Darwinian and therefore natural, good, and right. And, y'know, men can't help themselves.

[lesbiassparrow.livejournal.com]

And according to one commentator in the future we could just get rid of the memories of rape so there will be no harm done.

[crumpeteer.livejournal.com]

Okay, that second link broke my brain and not in the good way. Did the writer not even consider the emotional, psychological and physical trauma that is present in a rape and NOT when dealing with FOOD? So rape is just a biological urge? Haven't psychologists boiled rape down to a power issue and NOT an urge to procreate?

What makes me even angrier is that the writer seems to consider access to sex a right of men. WHAT? SINCE WHEN?

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

"What makes me even angrier is that the writer seems to consider access to sex a right of men. WHAT? SINCE WHEN?"

I...was going to comment on this and something else(wholly unrelated to you) but it's another can of worms that I don't want to open.

Sexuality/love/rights/fulfillment are still viewed as being more important in the context of the male than the female.

If the mass hordes of fandom and fiction don't make that clear, guys like this do.

[crumpeteer.livejournal.com]

I've never liked rape being used as a plot device in fandom, mainly because it's always generally done so glibly in the best of circumstances and offensively in the worst.

[joketsu.livejournal.com]

I wonder if that first one took into account that a lot of animal shelters euthanize animals right away or a few days after they're brought in?

As for the second? "Why do we, as a society, provide food stamps for the hungry but not sex stamps for the celibate?" Has to be about one of the stupidest things I've ever read. This guy probably fancies himself the owner of a vast intellect, too.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

First one: Yes. I also suspect that most donors don't think about that, either.

Second one: He probably thinks the world would be a better place if more women slept with guys like him.

[laura-holt-pi.livejournal.com]

I did point that out, amongst other things. I may have been a little more4 scathing than is fair with a bunch of inadequates. Since I'm not sure they won't remove my comment, here is what I said:

I've never seen so many idiots gathered in one place. I can only assume that a large proportion of you are still waiting to have sex with somebody non-inflatable.

First of all, Darwin has nothing to do with rape. Some rapists are men who have had vasectomies, others choose to use a condom. Rape is not a matter of "I must pass on my genes!" It's more, "I hate women, I want to hurt one!" This is not the "hysterical" view of feminists (I am not one, by the way) but a fact accepted by every authority on the subject. Rape is a way to destroy a woman's life and is used by men who like to do that, often because, like many posting here, they have a deep resentment of women and blame them for the fact that their lives are bad. A rapist is virtually always a complete inadequate. Rape is a crime of the ego, not of any Darwinian imperative. I thought even trained chimps could figure that out, but apparently some people are still sympathetic towards rapists.

Food is essential. If you're starving, it's not wrong to steal something to survive. Most of the posters here can testify that you don't die from lack of sex, because, let's face it, no-one expressing the views expressed here is ever going to get within a hundred yards of a woman and no-one who had ever had the remotest affection for or from a woman would utter the drivel spouted here.

Many millions of people have lived their entire lives without sex and would never consider raping anyone. Many women are celibate, but don't go raping men. You will never see a pack of nuns chasing some young man down the street compelled by their need to pass on their genes.

Also, why do men rape other men? Does Darwinism explain that? And is that something that should also be considered like stealing food, or is that terrible and wicked and wrong? Just wondering.

I suppose you do know that the analogy of rape to stealing food assumes that a woman has the same value as a potato? No wonder none of you can get dates!

Incidentally, the concept of the selfish gene is DAWKINS not DARWIN, but I suppose that's irrelevant to those who are looking to justify sex crimes by appealing to science they do not adequately understand.

[laura-holt-pi.livejournal.com]

I must confess, I don't see a difference between protecting puppies and protecting humans, but then, as a druid, I consider all lives to have equal value.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

The problems isn't "protecting the puppies," (I want them to be protected!) but that people tell the abused person to just help themselves and that it's their own fault.

[laura-holt-pi.livejournal.com]

That I do have a problem with.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

There's this idea that because a woman has legs, she can free herself. Now, while I'd like to think that, if I'm ever with someone who hurts me or my child, I will walk. However, a lot of these women have no money, no jobs, no friends, are cut off from their family, have nowhere to go, have children, have been threatened, have had their child threatened, have seen someone get hurt for trying to help them, or simply know their abuser well enough to know that if they try to get away but can't, it will just be worse. A lot of people, however, just refuse to acknowledge that threat. A lot of it, I think, is that they simply fear the same happening to them and realize it COULD be them, but they're lucky, or don't want to face the chances that it's happening to someone they know, and they don't realize it.

Meanwhile, the second someone thinks a puppy MIGHT have been kicked, there's mass outrage. This is not remotely to condone or excuse the kicking of puppies. puppies are little and cute and it's easy to see when they need help(though, as was pointed out above, a shelter may not always be the best place for them) and to fix that, it's not nearly so easy when it's an abused human. And no one ever says a puppy deserved to be kicked, or yelled at, or thrown against a wall, or anything else.

[laura-holt-pi.livejournal.com]

I have known people who say it is fine to hurt puppies, because they're mere animals and don't suffer.

I've known people involved in domestic violence. Men choose women who are insecure to begin with, then spend months or years making them wholly dependant. Then they start abusing them, often telling them he will take the kids away if they try to leave. A friend of mine only managed to leave her husband when her son saw her badly hurt. She realised that losing his father was not going to be as bad for the boy as seeing his mother repeatedly tortured. When she told him they were leaving, her son was delighted. He hated the things his father had done.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Perhaps those people who said that should lie down so someone can kick them in the stomach once or twice. Possibly, they should be tied in a bag and dumped in the river for kicks. But pulled back out as soon as they got scaredand hopefully made the connection.

And yeah, a lot of the time, it isn't until he turns to the kids that the abused woman can leave. Probably because, even if you can convince her that she deserves it or won't get any vbetter, you can't convince her the same is true of her kid.

[kingcrankycat.livejournal.com]

Sadly this is not the worst stuff I've read this week. Still, the ignorance levels of those two posts are simply epic. *shakes head in frustration* I won't bother with debating the 'logic' of the posts, it's clear it would merely be a waste of bytes. Instead, I'm off to have a far more intelligent conversation with my cat.

[smillaraaq.livejournal.com]

Oh, god, more of the "Overcoming Bias" nonsense. THE IRONY OF THE SITE NAME, IT BURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRNS.

As for the animal abuse versus domestic violence link -- yet another reason to care about both rather than treating it as an either/or situation is that both forms of abuse can be intimately connected. Abusers will often hurt or threaten a beloved pet as yet another way to intimidate, punish, and manipulate their victims; and the fear of what might happen if they leave a pet behind with such an abuser, or give them up to a shelter, can be another factor making abuse victims reluctant to leave a bad situation.

Andrew Vachss' site The Zero has a ton of valuable references on the connection between domestic violence, child abuse and animal abuse here (http://vachss.com/help_text/animal_dv.html).

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Ithink the site is run by men convinced the world would be a better place if women just automatically slepot with them because they said they were nice guys.

And yeah, abusers will use ANYTHING to manipulate or control their victims. Pet are right up there with kids.

[seven-trees.livejournal.com]

That second one is a real gem.

It's 7:00 a.m. and I'm already pissed off. Excellent.

God, I hate people.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

it's made so easy sometimes

[fairest1.livejournal.com]

Could you start adding in links of, say, adorable kittens romping around? The world needs some balance.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

an old kittyspam, but:

http://meganbmoore.livejournal.com/162043.html#cutid1

[fairest1.livejournal.com]

Awww, kitties!

[jessicamee.livejournal.com]

grrrr, that makes me want to shoot people.

1. There really is nothing stopping them from leaving unless their husband is contantly standing in all door ways out of the house with a gun or has them tide up. Those puppies never did anything to anybody and besides, there are more of them. and its easier to kill the poor puppies so more of them are going to die. so yes, save the puppies.

2. What an asshole!! first, rape is about control, not about sex. and second, YOU CAN LIVE WITHOUT SEX. A starving man can steal food to stay alive, a sex deprived man can hire a fucking prostatue. rape cannot be justified. what a jerk. i hope he gets ass raped one day.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

1a. As mentioned elsewhere in the post, most animal shelters put down the animals within days of their arrival. As awful as it is, unless they get lucky and are adopted quickly, most animals that go into shelters don't come back out.

1b. Physical abuse usually comes after the psycholigical abuse. Many battered women have (because of their abuser's control) no job, no money, no personal bank account or credit card, and little social contact. In addition, abusers use threats against children and pets, as well as other family members, as leverage against their victims. It's almost never a case of "I have a normal life, and he suddenly started hitting me." The physical abuse usually doesn't come until he's stripped the victim of all autonomy and control, and often not until he has some other leverage to hold against her (abusing their child instead, child custody, or even a pet that can't be taken to a shelter if she flees.) If it were as simple as he suddenly starts hitting her, then yes, she could walk. But usually, the physical abuse doesn't start until he's slowly broken her and taken over all facets of her life.

[jessicamee.livejournal.com]

the poor animals!! that's why i want to adopt more pets.

yeah, i guess so. i didn't think about them having a pet. cuz you could take your kid with you but your pet would be harder. :/ well that sucks. so i see you're point but still! the poor puppies!

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

ACtually, it isn't even as simple as taking your kid, because he can still press for custody, and unfortunately, the courts still sometimes think she's "making it up" and he's a "good father" and give him full or partial custody. And if she has no job, or enough money for a good home...

[jessicamee.livejournal.com]

ughhh, that custody thing is a bitch.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Yup. The short version of all this is that, when it IS as simple as a woman being able to walk away, she does. But it rarely is.

[jessicamee.livejournal.com]

alright, i get it.