randomosity

[meganbmoore]

1. I have not been home since shortly after waking up. Seriously, I didn't even check e-mail/LJ until I got to work (just finished). I thought about it, and then I realized that the stomping over my head would be ALL DAY LONG and fled.

End result was poking around bookstores, even though I'm not supposed to be visiting them until after the Book Sale O Doom next month. (Anyone read Midori Snyder? I picked up a couple of her books on a whim.)

Now, Mystery Writers of the World: I realize you want to write in historical periods. I highly approve of you writing in historical periods. However, pleasepleaseplease stop using "Such-and-such historical figure/writer/character is my detective"*. Please. I beg you. Because most of thesethat I've read aren't that good.

2. Linked by woodburner, if you read YA fiction, you are a pedophile. PST! Don't tell this person that Harry Potter, Twilight and Eragon are YA, much less that the target age group for most licensed manga is 13! (Yesyesyes, they mentioned HP. Still...)

3. I forget where I got this site from, but I swear no manga review site has ever filled me with such rage. At first I thought it was judt that they were endlessly praising series I think are shallow at best, but more often overrated series that cater to the lowest common denominator (still on the kind end), while anything that I thought had any worth was dismissed as bad or boring for not specifically catering to the reviewers preferences. Then I read a few where manga I really liked was being praised, and got even more annoyed. I share this because I spent an hour or two tere, getting more and more annoyed. I think it may now be my anti-manga rec. I also suspect a few here will get many LULZ out of some of their recs.

4. Linked by coraa, 5 Thoughts on the Popularity of Steampunk. I'm particularly interested in shared-gender geekery and bridging the sub-genre gap. Which makes me wonder: how much further back could the basic idea go? At the core, steampunk is tied around the idea of the industrial revolution going faster and in different ways, but what other "girly" periods could it be applied to? The Elizabethan period comes to mind. It isn't necessarily thought of as a "girly" period, but it is a romantic period in the public mind, as well as a period of swashbuckling and exploration, and you not only have people wanting new and faster and better ways to exoplore, but you also have advances in ways to wage war. And then you go back a little further and have people like Da Vinci inventing things, only have them take off. Random food for thought.

5. the CLAMP friending meme!



*I make 2 exceptions(the only 2 bearable ones I've found): Bruce Alexander's John Fielding mysteries, and Susan Wittig Albert's Beatrix Potter books. Albert's book barely even nod at the nysteries, and Sir John Fielding is the founder of the Bow Street Runners. That makes perfect sense (and even though he's the title character, the main character is his ward.)

Comments

[kirarakim.livejournal.com]

Reading that YA essay I don't think he thinks if adults read YA books they are pedophile. He is just saying that the public could view them as this. While I think that is a little extreme, I do know a lot of adults who would sadly refuse to read anything that is targeted to teens and kids. I actually sort of agree with the author's sentiment that I am not sure what the point of the target demographic is. I think it is great to write books with young adult/teenage protagonist but I think calling them young adult books actually alienates both adults and teens. Adults are afraid to be reading something labeled "young adult" while teens the actual target audience would rather read "adult" books.

On a side note as a fan of Steam Punk that was an interesting read. :)

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

"When scifi novels with adolescent protagonists are marketed as "just for adolescents," a curtain of taboo falls between most adults and that novel. In an era where there is so much legal panic around relations between adults and young adults, it's hard to deny your knee-jerk response that there's something slightly distasteful and pedophilic about an adult reading stories aimed at people under the age of 18."

He may not be directly stating it, but he's implying that you should assume it'll be seen that way, which I disagree with. It seems to stem from the same idea that any interest in children or children's interests by an adult should be viewed with suspicion.

But yes, the steampunk article was interesting.

[kirarakim.livejournal.com]

Well I think its more that he thinks the public will view an adult reading YA fiction as negative not that he personally does. And sadly I agree that it is looked down upon by the public unless it is something really well known like Harry Potter. And even with that people try to justify it and say that it's a lot more adult then it seems. Like they can't admit that they are reading a YA novel. Although I feel that bringing up the issue of Pedophilia is extreme.

It's true that I don't usually identify with characters in YA novels but I find since they usually have growing up themes they can be excellent examples of well done character development. This is why I like these type of stories as an adult.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I rarely identify with fictional characters in general, actually, and have never understood the emphasis some people put on it.

The thing about "pedophilia" is that it's one of those things where, once that word is brought up, it's permanently attached to the idea. It's like how people hear the word "abortion" and don't know or think anything about the Conscience Rule.

[woodburner.livejournal.com]

"The thing about "pedophilia" is that it's one of those things where, once that word is brought up, it's permanently attached to the idea."

Yes, and that thought is beginning to tick me off. Thanks, bub, for making it even harder for YA to gain acceptance as "real" literature.

[kyuuketsukirui.livejournal.com]

Wow, that post about YA is rage-making. I don't read a lot of YA fiction, but I do read a lot of manga, and as you noted, most manga is aimed at teens, especially the hugely popular stuff. Hell, I've even read and enjoyed series aimed at pre-teens (if your protagonist is 12 or 13, you can bet the target age is a few years younger). I've never once felt like a pedophile for doing so, wtf.

And there was a commenter in the post saying that YA was something new and just a flash in the pan. Uh...there was YA when I was a kid and I'm 32.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I think the problem is that, even though the author has a point about defining the genre and do we need it as a separaet genre, it starts getting lost when it turns there, because it's "assume people will think badly of you for something there's nothing wrong with."

[kyuuketsukirui.livejournal.com]

Not only is he saying to assume people will think badly of you, but by phrasing it as "it's hard to deny your knee-jerk response that there's something slightly distasteful and pedophilic", he's asserting that it's not just "the mundanes" or "society" who feel it's wrong, but his audience and presumably himself as well.

[kingcrankycat.livejournal.com]

Kirarakim already noted it, but I don't think the writer believes that YA is pedophilia, but that it is how the public views an adult reading a YA book (bearing in mind that most of the public couldn't differentiate a kid's book from Shakespeare, but that's another point entirely). And while the thought might not immediately jump to "pedophile" there is certainly a very large stigma attached to reading YA books as an adult. It's all based in perception, not in fact.

There's a reason that publishers in England released the Harry Potter books with two different covers, one for kids and one for adults.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Yes, but I think that even bringing it up tends to attach the word more strongly to the idea. It's one of those words where, once you've seen it connected to something, if you aren't already in the know about that something. I can't think of any reason to even bring it up besides deliberately attaching the stihmain people's minds.

[woodburner.livejournal.com]

My issue with what h/she said was not that he equated reading YA lit with pedophilia, but that he made that assumption, the assumption that the public views reading YA as skeevy. It has never once crossed my mind that something could be skeevy about it, and the fact that it crossed that author's mind creeps me out. If that's the first thing you think when you see an adult reading a YA book? That's skeevy.

Yes, there's a silly stigma attached to reading YA, but the stigma is based on the perception of "if it's for a younger audience, it's not as good/sophisticated", not "OH HAY LOOK, IT'S A PEDO!" I am totally boggling at how that could cross anyone's mind.

[swanjun.livejournal.com]

I was really worried link #3 was my site, for some reason. I haven't read much of the content there, but that is where I was spoiled on a very major development for NANA in an article that was just supposed to be discussing several series in a general way. I was displeased.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Yup. It completely spoils everything in every review, if it's not dismissing it out of hand, and it assumes that anything that isn't 100% their own taste is bad or boring. (And, mind you, for the most part, I don't think much of their taste. But there's a difference between lot liking something because it doesn't match your tastes, and assuming something that doesn't match your tastes is automatically bad.

[dangermousie.livejournal.com]

I am trying to figure out why that manga site bugged you so. I read some reviews and I agree with some and not others, but it doesn't seem so bad. Seems a pretty decent review site to me so am curious...(even if she did give Furuba in boredom).

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Various things:

1) In a lot of the reviews I read, there was either a very elitist attitude, or an assumption of elitism from those who don't agree. For example, a review of a manhwa I really like essentially started off "some will nitpick at calling this manga, as it's manhwa. The only difference between manga and manhwa is where they're from and what the names look like. People need to get over this." (Only not put as politely.) It wasn't the sentiment, it was how it was expressed. I stopped reading the rview, even though I love the series, and if I'd stumbled across it looking for info about the series, I still would have walked away.

2) No differentiation between taste/preference and quality. "It is not exactly what I want, therefore, it is bad and/or boring."

3) Many of the reviews aren't reviews, but play-by-plays. It's one thing to do that for an LJ entry, another to post it at a review site and call it a review. In addition, many of the "recommendation" entries for various series are summaries of the story, plot point by plot point, with no warning. Most people, when they see "recommendation" go in expecting setup, characters and themes, not the etnire story condensed into a wall of text.

[rikoren.livejournal.com]

...Y'know, I think I read almost nothing but YA fiction. When I pick out a book to read, I don't bother to check what age group it's for, I just go "Hey look, this book has centaur hackers in it!" and go for it. I wonder if this makes me a pedophile.

Also, I really liked that steampunk article, and...that review site is kind of...not so good. Yes.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

It doesn't make you a pedophile, but you should assume that everyone will think you are one for reading it.

Yeah. I looked at the review site again before linking, to see if it pissed me off as much as it did before. It did.

[rikoren.livejournal.com]

Hmm...Luckily, people often mistake me for a 14-year-old, so I should probably be able to get away with it for at least another year or so.

The first review I looked at seemed okay, though on second glance I realized they were listing what happened in every volume I hadn't read. Second one was a review for volume 1 only, but it kept mentioning things that would happen later in the series. I think those reviewers are doing their job wrong.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Yup. "Play-by-play"="review" is one of the big problems.

[animeshon.livejournal.com]

I'm sorry WTF is with that guys YA is just younger characters and makes you feel guilty reading it?! I'm proud that I love reading YA and for the most part the genre of YA is defined by yes the protagonist being between 12 and 18, but also the fact the majority of the themes of YA fiction and the stories themselves centre around the experience of Young Adults. I read them for the most part because they are an enjoyable and easy read. There are as always exceptions to this that cross the boundaries and deal with adult topics where the protagonist is a teenager, but for the most part they don't. (sorry for the rant)

As for the manga site, I'm a little confused as to why their number one manga is tramps like us! And seriously her review of W-Juliet is bloody harsh!

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

No comments on TLU, as I haven't read it, but like most of the negative reviews, the W Juliet review is "This does not 100% cater to my every preference. Therefore, it is bad and boring."

I wouldn't mind if they said "this is too light and fluffy for my tastes/I don't care for this take on gender bending, so I won't be reading more" but instead they said "well, this isn't what I consider to be the perfect shoujo, so it's bad."

[animeshon.livejournal.com]

Their reviews are just so empty, there is no discussion of the art work and what they like and don't like, or and of the elements it's just "I didn't like it, therefore not worth reading"

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Yup. What I post is closer to being reviews, and I'd never call most of them reviews.

[animeshon.livejournal.com]

Exactly, my rants are about the same as their "reviews" which I find sad considering that is a review website. I'm trying to set up my own review website and the hardest part has been writing actual reviews that are un-biased (at least as much as you can be) and actually talk about why i like or don't like x.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I can be relatively unbiased and/or factual in my first post on a series, but after that, it's "squee squee squee" or "Whine whine whine".

[animeshon.livejournal.com]

Yeah sometimes my sole reason for liking a manga is one character!

[rhap-chan.livejournal.com]

I feel so happy you linked my meme. <3

[(Anonymous)]

YA dude makes some valid points, and I am reminded of my library, which classes all manga as YA. Including Monster and Uzumaki. But bringing up pedophilia is excessive and not even really relevant. Steampunk article looks neat. Will read fully when on a computer.

[annwyd.livejournal.com]

That was me posting from my cellphone. Whoops.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

Ah. I figured whoever it was would come back and comment.

[escalove.livejournal.com]

I disagree with the YA article a lot, and not just because of the "pedophile" thing but I do thing YA is a necessary class of literature (not genre because YA houses different genres) they are supposed to be written to a certain point of development and most YA do focus on coming of age, belonging, and other issues that adolescence face. This isn't to say that teens can't and won't read adult fiction but usually YA acts as a bridge, and I think for people who really good readers don't understand what it is like for those who struggle with it and so for them to have a section with books that they can read and understand is important, the fact that YA has a lot of stories that attract older readers is just a bonus.

That manga review site made me laugh. I can't understand how they could recommend Koukou Debut and not W Juliet, because while I adore KD it can be a bit typical shoujo at times.

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

There's also, I think, a "safe haven" feel for YA. It handles a lot of themes, but not in the same ways as adult fic does.

The manga review website just makes no sense.

ETA: I'd also say KD is even more "typical shoujo" than W Juliet.

[escalove.livejournal.com]

That is definitely a part of it too, and it links with development too, which I think a lot of people who keep asking why we do we need a separate category don't quite get.

Re the ETA, that was what I meant, but I was typing up in a whirlwind.

Koukou Debut is pretty much standard fluffy shoujo at its finest, and that where it shines is that the couple is uniquely charming.

But W Juliet breaks more ground in the look of the characters and the situation.

I don't know it was just bizarre, I mean it is possible to like one and not the other but for the reasons they gave, I was a little 'bzuh'

[meganbmoore.livejournal.com]

I honestly read the WJ as "I'm not in the mood for it just this second, so it sucks."

I think that, for something that's pure shoujo fluff, WJ breaks a lot of groubd, and it manages to cover areas and issues most shoujo don't, while avoidign the tired angst tropes.

[akosikae.livejournal.com]

I left one a while ago. The store is on sale. Found one that looks interesting, but not enough to really really hook me so I'm looking at the internet right now. It's Exit A by Anthony Swofford.